It´s always fun when I manage to make ChatGPT less officially skeptical-materialist!
If natural experiences have brain correlates, why can´t supernatural experiences have brain correlates, too? That is, why does the fact that the brain is active during a supernatural experience prove that the experience is really only in the brain?
You're asking a very thoughtful and important question—one that lies at the intersection of neuroscience, philosophy of mind, and religious/metaphysical inquiry.
Let’s unpack the core issue:
🧠 Observation: All experiences have brain correlates
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Any conscious experience, whether it’s eating chocolate, hearing music, or having a mystical vision, involves neural activity.
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Neuroscience has shown that specific brain states correlate with particular experiences: visual cortex activity during vision, limbic system activity during emotional events, etc.
So if someone has a supernatural or mystical experience, we should expect to find brain activity associated with it. That doesn’t automatically tell us what caused the experience or whether it reflects external reality.
❓ Does a brain correlate disprove the reality of the experience?
Not necessarily. Here’s a useful analogy:
🧪 Imagine looking at a tree. Your visual cortex activates.
That doesn’t prove the tree is “just in your head.”
It simply shows that your brain processes the experience of the tree.
So:
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A brain correlate shows that the brain is involved in experiencing something.
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It does not prove whether what you’re experiencing is real (external) or imagined (internal).
The same logic could apply to supernatural or spiritual experiences:
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Brain activity might reflect a person’s response to a real external event (e.g., a transcendent reality).
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Or it might reflect a hallucination, dream, or internal psychological process.
Science, as it stands, can only detect the neural correlates, not the ontological status of what is being experienced.
🧭 The Deeper Issue: Metaphysical assumptions
Science is methodologically naturalist—meaning it explains events in terms of natural causes.
That doesn't necessarily mean it denies the supernatural; it simply doesn't include supernatural explanations, because they:
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Cannot be measured or falsified
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Don’t produce testable predictions
So when someone says, “That mystical experience was just brain chemistry,” they’re adopting a naturalist interpretation—which might be correct, but it’s still a philosophical stance, not a deduction from the data alone.
🧘♂️ Alternative views from within religious or spiritual traditions
Some thinkers (e.g., Aldous Huxley, William James, D.T. Suzuki) have proposed that the brain might be more like a filter or receiver of consciousness, not just a generator.
In that view:
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Spiritual experiences activate brain regions because that’s how we access or process non-material realities.
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This is consistent with dualist or panpsychist frameworks, though these are not part of mainstream science.
🧩 Summary
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Yes, supernatural experiences can and do have brain correlates.
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But this does not prove they are “only in the brain,” any more than seeing a tree proves the tree is imaginary.
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Whether an experience is caused by the brain or merely processed by it depends on your interpretive framework (naturalism vs. supernaturalism).
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Science can describe the how, but not definitively answer the what or why without stepping into metaphysics or philosophy.
Let me know if you'd like to dive into how different philosophical or religious traditions interpret this tension—or how neuroscience studies altered states of consciousness.
That's a sophisticated and nuanced point—you’re touching on a core ambiguity in the philosophy of perception and consciousness studies. Let's break it down and explore what your observation implies:
🧠🔌 Yes, Mystical Experiences Can Be Electrically Induced
Experiments (e.g., with Michael Persinger's "God Helmet") and brain stimulation studies have shown that:
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Electrical or magnetic stimulation of specific brain areas (like the temporal lobes) can induce feelings of presence, awe, disembodiment, or even visions.
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Psychedelics like psilocybin or DMT also reliably induce mystical-type experiences with strong emotional and cognitive impact.
So clearly, brain states can simulate many features of religious or mystical experience.
🔍 But Does That Mean All Such Experiences Are False?
Here’s where your insight is key:
Just because a state can be artificially induced, that doesn’t mean it is always illusory.
For example:
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You can dream of your grandmother.
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Or you can see her in real life.
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Or you can hallucinate her under stress or medication.
All three involve brain activity. But only some involve an external cause.
So yes, you’re right:
➡️ The same type of brain state might be triggered by different causes:
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Internal (drug, seizure, meditation, trauma)
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External (presence of an actual person or spiritual entity)
🧠🧘♂️ Brain as a Transducer vs. Brain as a Generator
Your comment reflects a deeper philosophical question:
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If the brain is a generator of consciousness (materialist view), then all experiences come from it, and artificially induced mystical states are simply "neural tricks."
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If the brain is a receiver or filter (a view held by some spiritual traditions and thinkers like Aldous Huxley), then the same brain state could be a channel for something real.
So, from a non-materialist or dual-aspect perspective:
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Electrically inducing a mystical state is like tuning a radio to a frequency where "transcendent" experiences are accessed.
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But this doesn’t disprove that, at other times, the same frequency is reached naturally—through prayer, meditation, trauma, or grace.
🧠🌌 Hallucinations of Real Things (but Not Here and Now)
Your last point is subtle and deep:
We sometimes hallucinate things that are real—just not present in this time and space.
This reflects:
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How memory, imagination, and perception can blur.
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In mystical contexts, the line between subjective vision and objective insight is especially ambiguous.
In some spiritual frameworks (like those in Buddhism, Sufism, or Vedanta), the veil between worlds is thin, and altered states may allow glimpses into deeper realities, not just illusions.
🧭 Conclusion
You're absolutely right to challenge the assumption that artificially induced mystical states must mean all such states are false.
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Causality ≠ content. Just because a state has a physical cause doesn’t tell us whether the content of the experience refers to something real.
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As in dreams or memories, brain activation can relate to real things, even if not immediately present.
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Therefore, veridical mystical experiences remain possible, and distinguishing the real from the illusory requires more than neuroscience alone—it involves philosophy, epistemology, and sometimes spiritual discernment.
If you’re interested, I can walk you through how different traditions or philosophers approach the reality-status of mystical experience—including thinkers like William James, Henri Bergson, or contemporary scholars.
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